Why does the flywheel have teeth


Leave the archive and display this page in the standard design: starter, 8 or 9 teeth



Hello everybody,
the topic has been here a few times, but maybe not everything is so clear. I was considering whether to give my R75 / 6 the somewhat more powerful Valeo starter, because starting is sometimes a bit difficult, especially after installing the SR 1000 cc set. With engine / frame number 4030500, the year of construction should be 10/1975. As I had read, the starter with 9 teeth was installed from year 9/1975. Yesterday I removed my starter and counted: there are only 8 teeth! Is my information wrong with the change from 9/1975?

greeting
Franz

Yep, that was a year later. Give your Bosch a thorough cleaning, including re-greasing, then it will pull through better. Has already had a few years under his belt ...

OK, I did and I hope it gets better.

The entry in the knowledge database should then be changed accordingly. Can you do that as an administrator?
http://forum.2-ventiler.de/vbboard/showthread.php?14840-Anlasser

Franz

Wasn't the change from 8 to 9 teeth in September 1974, i.e. 1 year earlier and not later ??? ? (

Yep, that was a year later ...

Not quite ...
I'll correct that.

So the change was at the start of the / 7 series. I also discovered this ominous, but obviously incorrect, date 9/1975 in the lists of Ulis motorcycle shop. I couldn't really believe that such a far-reaching change (flywheel) would be made in the ongoing production from August to September.
?(
Franz

Hello,

the ring gear on the flywheel can be changed. Saw through the old sprocket and put on a new one. A Valeo can then also be mounted with it.

greeting
Walter

Hello

I am now slightly confused about the number of teeth on the starter on the / 6. Here the date of the change from 8 to 9 teeth was initially named 9/75, but then the changeover to the / 7 model series was shifted. But that doesn't seem right to me:

As far as I can understand, a modified flywheel with the reinforced flywheel bolts (11 instead of 10) was installed from autumn 75. In this context, the starter was also converted to the 9-tooth variant. (Anyway, I took it off somewhere)

A changeover date within the / 6 model series can be found not only at Ulis Motorradladen (as already mentioned above), but also, for example, at Israel: Quote on Valeo: "It replaces the Bosch starter from 1976 and of course the VALEO Teeth and does not fit the / 5 and early / 6, R 90S models with 8 teeth. "

(On the other hand, with various eBay offers, the information on the right model is handled quite creatively, to put it that way.)

Can someone bring more light into the dark?!?

greetings
Roland

I find everything is lit up.

/ 5 and early / 6 and early R90S with 10mm bolts on the flywheel.

Hello Thomas

I would want to see it that way too.
But with this we are in contradiction to the omniscient knowledge database, which currently contains the following sentence:
"Up to the start of row / 7 the pinion has 8 teeth, then 9 (the flywheel has also been changed)." mmmm
Future generations could be led astray ...

greetings
Roland

Today you have to name all the sources, otherwise you will lose the title:

A. Schwietzer:

III / 1974

"Increasing the starting speed by changing the toothing of the starter pinion and flywheel ring gear from 8:93 to 9: 111 improves the starting behavior."

Hope to have quoted correctly! : D

Today you have to name all the sources, otherwise the title will blow your mind:
"Increasing the starting speed by changing the toothing of the starter pinion and flywheel ring gear from 8:93 to 9: 111 improves the starting behavior."


Hello,

simply count the teeth once. The starters also differ in performance. 8 teeth = 0.5 KW and 9 teeth = 0.7 KW.


greeting
Walter

Hello,

simply count the teeth once.

greeting
Walter
Then it's like Walter says: just count your teeth. This takes about an hour with removal and installation. I was hoping that there would be a list where it says engine number 4030500 is built in 10/1975 and therefore has a starter with 8 teeth. But there doesn't seem to be such a list. :(

Franz

Then it's like Walter says: just count your teeth. This takes about an hour with removal and installation. I was hoping that there would be a list where it says engine number 4030500 is built in 10/1975 and therefore has a starter with 8 teeth. But there doesn't seem to be such a list. :(

Franz

Hello,

that's easier. Either at the hole for the ignition or at the top of the air filter box on the starter.

greeting
Walter

Why don't you just take the starter off (goes quickly) and count its teeth? : &&&:

Not quite ...
I'll correct that.

After all the confusion, I did some research.
I once had the problem myself that I wanted to build a Bosch from a 75/6 to a 75/7 ...

Unfortunately, the information in the ETK is also contradictory. There are changes for the starter from 09/74, for the flywheel from 09/75. : &&&:

My R90S is 5/75 from the month of construction and has 8 teeth.
Change was with 9/75.
With year of construction 76 the model year 76 was meant. That started after the factory break in 75.

Cite sources? They don't know any better either. Schwietzer is wrong.

Kind regards
ffritzle

So my R75 / 6 is first registered 3/1976, but according to the list at bmbikes.co.uk with the engine no. 4030500 built in 10/1975. I removed the starter and counted the teeth: 8! It may not be entirely wrong that the change began after the 1975 factory break. But maybe they started with the R90 and installed the remaining stock of 8-tooth starters with the corresponding flywheel on the R75 and R60.
Suggested formulation for the database:
Up to model 76 (production from Sep. 75, however, it is advisable to count ahead in the limit range 9-10 / 1975 when ordering spare parts) the pinion has 8 teeth, then 9 (the flywheel has also been changed).

greeting
Franz

Franz, who tells you that everything on your bike is still original? Did you buy it new back then?

Hello,

it is very unlikely that 8 tooth starters were still installed in 1976. The Opel Kadett A series was discontinued in 1975 and this had the same starter. Then another starter was installed at Opel for Kadett B.
The dealers used to get a bigger discount from the factory the earlier the motorcycles were ordered and delivered in the fall. Hence the difference between production date autumn 1975 and delivery spring 1976.

greeting
Walter

His bike was built in 10/75. And according to ETK there were only from / 7 9 teeth. Then everything would fit

Franz, who tells you that everything on your bike is still original? Did you buy it new back then?
I bought the R75 / 6 in 1981 with 55,000 km (matching numbers, still today). Nobody has removed the more modern 9-tooth starter including the flywheel ring in order to install the old 8-tooth starter. It may well be that the change from 8 to 9 teeth at BMW took several months. The transition was definitely connected with the / 7 series.

Franz

The transition was definitely connected with the / 7 series.

Franz

I believe that ALL / 5 + / 6 had 8 teeth and something was changed only at / 7.

The engine of my 90/6 is from 01/76 and the starter has
8 teeth !!
And to Walter.

My first car was a 1973 Kadett B !!!!
The Kadett C was built at the end of 74.) (-:



Greetings, Manfred

Hello,

With all the difficulties of determining the right time to change the starter, one should not forget the dilemma with the 10mm screws in the clutch. The new flywheels with 11.5mm screws all have starter rings for 9 teeth. The engine and the chassis can have the same number, but it is by no means said that the screws have not been changed.

greeting
Walter

The new flywheels with 11.5mm screws all have starter rings for 9 teeth.

greeting
Walter
That's right, my R75 / 6 has a starter with 8 teeth and 10 mm screws (fine thread) for the clutch.

Franz

Hello,

I was wrong in decade when specifying the Opel Kadett A. Not 1975 but 1965 is correct. The starter can practically no longer be obtained.

greeting
Walter

I just dissected a / 6 engine. Production was Sep 74, EZ Apr 75. I found the following components:
- Reinforced engine housing (from Sep 73), but with a recess for the old crankshaft; I've never seen this combination before ...

29593

- Crankshaft new version without "boom" with M11
- Flywheel 111 / starter 9 teeth.

The change in Sep 74 is probably correct and is now in the starter topic in the DB.
As my example shows, you have to reckon with all sorts of surprises at the limit of the model change ...

Hello,
Unfortunately I have to question the date of the change again,
Today I removed the starter of my 60/6, production date 5/76: it only has eight teeth. The engine has the same numbers, the flywheel has 11 screws. I didn't count the number of teeth on the disc.
Could it be that the newer flywheel and the nine-tooth starter were changed independently of each other? Or that there are eight-tooth and nine-tooth starters for the 111 flywheel?

Slightly perplexed greetings
Roland

I am also convinced that the transition from 8 to 9 teeth on the 60/6, 75/6, 90/6 and 90S took place in different months.
Kind regards
ffritzle

In the ETK there are spare parts for starters up to 8/74 and the complete Valeo from 9/74 with all. Spare parts also from 9/74. And that's exactly where the switch was made from 8 to 9 teeth!

How do you always know if your 30-40 year old engine is still original?
I'm currently building one, housing early 90s, electrics / 5, simple chain, oil pump + rocker arm / 7, heavy swing, starter from FeuerFritz with 9 teeth ...

So just count, then you can't go wrong: ---)

In the ETK there are spare parts for starters up to 8/74 and the complete Valeo from 9/74 with all. Spare parts also from 9/74. And that's exactly where the switch was made from 8 to 9 teeth!

How do you always know if your 30-40 year old engine is still original?
I'm currently building one, housing early 90s, electrics / 5, simple chain, oil pump + rocker arm / 7, heavy swing, starter from FeuerFritz with 9 teeth ...

So just count, then you can't go wrong: ---)

I don't know why you call the ETK so much. You have probably never had an Italian where every moped rolled off the assembly line individually. : nothing:

I don't know why you call the ETK so much. You probably haven't had an Italian yet where every moped rolled off the assembly line individually. : nothing:


Sorry, I'm just stupid. I thought we were talking about BMW: ---)

Sorry, I'm just stupid. I thought we were talking about BMW: ---)

I don't know anything about the first part. : ---)

But with the introduction of the / 6 they had so much shit going on that there might have been uncontrolled action (the production was in Berlin): &&&:

PS: another little anecdote on the subject

In 1984 the gearbox of my / 6 got overheated. Then I ordered a replacement transmission from BMW. Back then there was only microfiche. So no ETK. Meine / 6 is built in 9/73 so the first month of production.
Then came a gearbox for the easy swing. When it came to the parts distribution, Hammse meant that this was not a problem at all. Just swap the crankshaft and the clutch and then it fits. So much for BMW ....

Back then there was only microfiche. So no ETK.

: ---) ... and the makeshift catalog!

: ---) ... and the makeshift catalog!

..and did it help? Nope was wrongly ordered anyway.

And in case I haven't put it clearly for you: my dealer only worked with microfiche at the time.

My / 6 was construction month 2/76 and had 9 teeth on the starter.
@ Michael: I have just such a thing at home, a reinforced housing with a recess and an old crankshaft. Year of construction 74, screws M 11x1.5 and flywheel with 111 teeth ....

My 90/6 from May 75 also has the starter with 8 teeth, M10 crankshaft, heavy swing

My 90/6 from May 75 also has the starter with 8 teeth, M10 crankshaft, heavy swing
Then you have hopefully built a different starter on it after the crankshaft was changed: sabbel:

... the old crankshaft that was in there before: please:

So guys

I'm slowly getting the feeling that they are in production
der / 6 everything just taken off the shelf as it is inside
lay !!!: laugh out loud1:

Greetings, Manfred

My 90/6 from May 75 also has the starter with 8 teeth, M10 crankshaft, heavy swing

Hello Diemar,

In the then forgotten part of the republic, the clocks go differently. In my then R90 / 6 of 74 the KW broke through in the middle and all the inner ones were replaced. Then, according to ETK, it comes to a mess that can no longer be explained today.

greeting
Walter

The gear of my 75/6, EZ / 76, is currently in Dischingen for a cure, I quickly removed my Bosch starter. It actually only has 8 teeth, I would have sworn it would have to be 9!
?(
You don't have to remove the starter, after removing the cover you can see whether it is an 8 or 9 tooth:

30150 30151

Left old, Made in Germanistan, 8 teeth, the support for the magnetic switch is made of cast steel.
Not quite that old on the right, Made in Spain, from my CS, 9 teeth, the carrier is made of cast aluminum. Can be easily seen without dismantling when the hood is removed.

Hello again.

I have to contradict Kurt: You can't tell the number of teeth so easily on the case.
attached the picture of the Bosch starter of my 100/7 with 9 teeth. Visually identical to the 8-tooth starters of the / 6!

greetings
Roland

@ Roland: Ashes on my head, I'll never say it again!
:&&&:

Seriously, Lechmanni has definitely hit the nail on the head!
When the starter was out, I found hyroglyphs on the engine housing, which, as a non-antiquity researcher, I couldn't decipher either. Everything original and come from the factory like this:


30290

Perhaps the advice to the starter installer to take the 8 or 9 tooth Bosch off the shelf.

The apprentices signed when they got their apprenticeship contract. : D

I once summarized from the various contributions:

R60: 04/75 9 and 05/76 8
R75: 10/75 8 and 02/76 9
R90: 01/76 8.

We learn: everything fits everywhere and nothing goes nowhere.
So you always have to check with / 6.

People. After 4 weeks I now understand outside railings and nothing. My new engine is from 1977. Do I have a usable replacement starter in the basement or not?

Hello Uwe,
let's put it this way: There are reasonable indications that it fits.

So far we have at least not heard of any case that a / 7 (i.e. from 77) would have an 8-tooth starter.

Edith: I have just seen that you own a 90/6: the flywheel is the decisive part and does not, in the strict sense, belong to the engine. If this is from / 6, see MM above.

greetings
Roland

Hm .. I think I assumed too much background knowledge. Sorry

In the basement there is an engine from an R90 / 6 with production in autumn 1973. I'm driving a new engine from 1977. So I don't have / 7.

Does it affect me at all? : nothing:

Hello again

Of course we don't know what was used when your motorcycle was converted ...

But: Your 90/6 engine from 73 almost certainly has the 8-tooth starter, because 73 also has another flywheel installed, which cannot be easily exchanged for a new one (different screw size)

Your 77 engine is a / 7 engine from the year of construction. It actually includes a 9-tooth starter (and a corresponding flywheel). But how it was solved for you is perhaps best remembered by yourself.

In that case, you wouldn't have a spare starter in the basement.
But: it doesn't matter, these things won't break anyway.

greetings
Roland

I'll go one better!

As I said, my engine is from 01/76.
The flywheel bolts are M10 * 1.
The starter has 8 teeth.
Could it have been exchanged before?!: Nothing:

But now even more confusion: The cylinder opening is 97mm: shock:

My conclusion: First expand, then look, then order!

Confused greetings from Manfred? (

We learn: everything fits everywhere and nothing goes nowhere.
So you always have to check with / 6.

Got it: everything doesn't fit anywhere and nothing works everywhere.


And when I get home at some point, which will still take some time, then I (no: I MAY!) Actually have to take the wrench in my hand and look. : drool:

Confirmation from my side:

my completely original 90S with EZ06 / 76 (cast "76" in the motor housing) has the manhole cover with 93 teeth and 11x1.5 screws, the starter has 8 teeth.
So you can forget all the writing about the year of construction and month, you actually have to remove the thing and count teeth when buying or selling spare parts.
As a Q-driver you are simply not used to something unsystematic ...: O

George




So guys

I'm slowly getting the feeling that they are in production
der / 6 everything just taken off the shelf as it is inside
lay !!!: laugh out loud1:

Greetings, Manfred

Hello,

the / 5 starter had 0.5 hp. The / 6 starter motor 0.6 HP at least an increase of 20% and both versions with 8 teeth. The last version from Spain has no performance designation and has 9 teeth.

greeting
Walter

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